Broadband News

CityFibre/Vodafone FTTH network lands in Cambridge

Cambridge has been added to the list of places across Great Britain where the CityFibre FTTH/FTTP roll-out is delivering premises passed and being sold via Vodafone Gigafast. The full list of live locations is Aberdeen, Bournemouth, Cambridge, Coventry, Huddersfield Milton Keynes, Peterborough and Stirling and the combined footprint we have been able find stands at 141,234 premises.

The initial footprint in Cambridge has brought the local authorities full fibre coverage up to the 10.66% mark and was part of a busy full fibre day when 9,000 premises passed by full fibre were added to the UK total which stands at 10.64%

Comments

In rural altnet world these premises must all now be compulsorily connected to CityFibre or they don't count. Premises passed is a bit of a con / scam, right?

  • CarlThomas
  • 11 months ago

Hi Carl and Others.
All Premises are recorded on the OFCom D/ Base which is very accurate to the (static Post Code Position) so that is the one that the 500+ ISP should use if they do not use it can causes problems in sale.

  • Blackmamba
  • 11 months ago

You've posted in the wrong news item @blackmamba

  • andrew
  • thinkbroadband staff
  • 11 months ago

It's also nonsense due to how rarely Ofcom update their database.

The Openreach one is the only option for CPs purchasing direct from them.

The BT Wholesale one, based on Openreach data, the only option for the hundreds of ISPs that are their customers.

  • CarlThomas
  • 11 months ago

@BM - please provide a link to the Ofcom database.

Selling to a property does not work by just reference to a postcode.

  • Somerset
  • 11 months ago

So BM this amazing database reckons ADSL is available at 5Mb at my new postcode, with superfast at 80/20 available to 100% of premises and ultrafast available to some.

The postcode is 100% FTTP.

I'll pass on every ISP using that checker if that's okay.

  • CarlThomas
  • 11 months ago

Hi Somerset. Just go to OFCom speed test and type in your post Code and you will see the (registered addresses LCC Rateable value ) properties
That list should tie with the BT / Checker So you have a hand shake between both systems.

  • Blackmamba
  • 11 months ago

@Blackmamba LCC Rateable value has nothing to do with broadband or the numerous broadband checkers.

Can I recommend you stop digging yourself into an ever deeper hole of confusion.

  • andrew
  • thinkbroadband staff
  • 11 months ago

@BM - please keep going!

For here says 80/20, not the more detailed figures on the Wholesale site, so as explained you are wrong.

Ofcom say: 'The checker should not be regarded as providing a definitive view and we plan to update the data later in the year.' Is that clear?

  • Somerset
  • 11 months ago

Hi Andrew. An incorrect address will not have a banding A ——H.

  • Blackmamba
  • 11 months ago

So tell us all where this banding A---H is then its not a part of the usual broadband checkers.

  • andrew
  • thinkbroadband staff
  • 11 months ago

Could be Council Tax bands:

Band A – up to £40,000
Band B – £40,001 to £52,000
Band C – £52,001 to £68,000
Band D – £68,001 to £88,000
Band E – £88,001 to £120,000
Band F – £120,001 to £160,000
Band G – 160,001 to £320,000
Band H – more than £320,000

This is difficult...

  • Somerset
  • 11 months ago

@Blackmamba I for one am sick to death of your repeated misinformation and often quite ridiculous posts. May I suggest you find some other place to post where the readers are happy to be fed what is much of the time simply tripe.

  • MCM999
  • 11 months ago

Hi Somerset. Waiting for a Call on a contract band F and one other on HS2 Pay out one they are both involved with copper and fibre on there Static Post Code which is tied to the OFCom d/base.

  • Blackmamba
  • 11 months ago

@BM - What Band F? Please explain what a band f is and how it relates to broadband provision.

Call from who?

Postcodes are just a convenient way of finding the actual property in a list.

  • Somerset
  • 11 months ago

Hi Somerset.
Yesterday I received a call over the HS2 Post Code GPS and it proved positive I am still waiting a call over a new build referring the Post Code services.

  • Blackmamba
  • 10 months ago

@BM - that makes no sense. HS2 Post Code GPS - what is that. Post Code services - what ones for what? Why were you being called?

  • Somerset
  • 10 months ago

Hi Somerset. Just receive a call that Taylor Wimpy at Bordon has (pre wired fibre 40% of 176 ) houses and should be showing black on TBB the 40% will be registered on OFCom D/ Base the sales department has the registered Post Codes.
I state again that the OFCom Addresses d/base is the controlling influence and is the most important one as it advertises the WiFi Squares coverage. The 500+ ISP,s should cross check on selling there products and see if there are any false addresses on the Static Post Code GPS position.

  • Blackmamba
  • 10 months ago

What are WiFi squares and how does a square for WiFi relate to broadband coverage?

@Blackmamba once again you are appear to be throwing a collection of words at the page that make no sense. No one here minds figuring things out for people who genuinely are seeking help, but you are more than that and I have concerns over what you are saying to the public in your area and what if any authority you are speaking under.

For record Ofcom database at best includes only premises prior to September 2019 at best and can find whole postcodes that are missing from before that date.

  • andrew
  • thinkbroadband staff
  • 10 months ago

For the record:

The Ofcom database uses the Openreach database.

95%+ of ISPs resell BT Wholesale services. Neither the Openreach checker or the Ofcom one can inform them of what is available to them.

Postcode areas aren't squares as you have claimed in the past.

Having people phone you when FTTP is built countywide is very strange.

Openreach GEA FTTP availability the authoritative source is the people building it.

For BT Wholesale resellers the BT Wholesale checker is the authoritative source. It shows them what their supplier will sell them.

Simple as that.

  • CarlThomas
  • 10 months ago

While I am at it the suggestion that because a developer has wired up FTTP it should show on the checker is ridiculous.

Is it actually connected to anything? Can people order? Guess which checker shows when they can order? As a hint it's nothing to do with the regulator.

The properties are FTTP enabled when Openreach say so, not when your random source says so.

This is not helpful. Until Openreach complete commissioning, reflected on their checker, and CPs have Cablelinks in place to connect to the FTTP customers, info on theirs, it doesn't matter what calls you are receiving.

  • CarlThomas
  • 10 months ago

' false addresses on the Static Post Code GPS position'

Again - GPS has nothing to do with this - what do you mean? How do we or an ISP check for false addresses and why would we?

Postcodes just identify a collection of properties, for utilities it is the actual full address that matters.

  • Somerset
  • 10 months ago

@BM - from 7 days ago:

'No-one cares about postcodes. No-one cares about Ofcom's database, it's not what's used to ascertain availability or in advertising.'

Ofcom say it is not accurate as in a previous post.

Do you now understand?

  • Somerset
  • 10 months ago

Right.

https://www.ofcom.org.uk/checker-app/about-the-checker

Expand 'About the broadband checker'.

Quote: 'The checker should not be regarded as providing a definitive view and we plan to update the data later in the year.'

If you insist on ignoring Ofcom's own comments on their checker please keep this ignorance to yourself, BM.

By the way from the same section: 'This checker uses broadband availability and predicted speeds data provided by the UK's major Internet Service Providers.'

The ISPs you think should be using that checker are the ones providing the data for it!

  • CarlThomas
  • 10 months ago

Hi Carl and Others.
If there is not a three way check between BT ISP, ( Openreach BT checker ) and (OFComs address list) the system is open to miss use or error. I feel it is the responsibility of the 500+ ISP s to check there data on the Post Codes.
My Data is incorrect on Post Code Gu266QD which is showing an incorrect address . My neighbour took Six months to get Broadband changed over because of this error.

  • Blackmamba
  • 10 months ago

Openreach use the same address source Ofcom do.

Ofcom use Openreach to determine availability of Openreach services.

For about the 3,000th time ISPs only care about what their supplier, Openreach, BT Wholesale, whomever, offer. In case of issues the supplier investigates internally and, if applicable, with their supplier.

Given you completely ignore everything written to you further conversation is futile. It isn't a conversation. It's people writing facts and your responding with babble and anecdote.

I really hope I retain my ability to accept facts and culpability in my later years.

  • CarlThomas
  • 10 months ago

  • Blackmamba
  • 10 months ago

The Royal Mail database should be correct.

  • Somerset
  • 10 months ago

Hi Somerset. Yes I do agree with you over the Royal Mail.
The postal round is calculated in Imperial ( Miles Yards) so the distance between Post Codes are imperial. Even from the FTTC.
This morning I have been told that the contract will be completed on the 3nd of Jan and the home will be in the E band plus it should be black on TBB maps.

  • Blackmamba
  • 10 months ago

All busineeses and industry work in metric and have for many years.

  • Somerset
  • 10 months ago

@BM - maybe you could tell us how the mile and the yard are defined internationally.

What is the 'E band'?

  • Somerset
  • 10 months ago

For the audience: postcodes are not a measure of distance or area. Streets, sides of streets or sections of sides of larger streets, in groups of about 100 premises, are allocated postcodes.

Developments have different postcodes for each street regardless of size.

They do not correlate to squares on a map. The length of postal delivery rounds is absolutely irrelevant to broadband provision.

Postcodes are nothing at all to do with broadband availability. It is measured in individual premises. Postcodes are no more relevant than street names.

Misinformation needs challenging.

  • CarlThomas
  • 10 months ago

Sources: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Postcodes_in_the_United_Kingdom

https://www.ons.gov.uk/methodology/geography/ukgeographies/postalgeography

https://www.cheshireeast.gov.uk/planning/address_management/royal_mail_postcodes.aspx

https://www.mapmarketing.com/pages/custom-postcode-maps-site-centred-maps-to-suit-your-business

Any map of individual postcodes showing them not overlaying any grid of squares but groups of <100 individual addresses by street or side of street.

  • CarlThomas
  • 10 months ago

@CT - I know, you know, but...

  • Somerset
  • 10 months ago

Regarding bands, Somerset, I suspect it's referring to the obsolete FTTPoD distance band from aggregation node.

Relevant to absolutely nothing, native FTTP doesn't use them, FTTPoD doesn't use them anymore so whoever is giving that information is writing nonsense, but relevant to nothing is an ongoing theme.

Of course new build FTTP infrastructure being physically built does not mean availability. There is more to do than just light fibre.

Best guess someone is chatting with a field engineer. Usual caveats apply to taking field guys' comments as gospel, especially 2nd hand information.

  • CarlThomas
  • 10 months ago

Ran out of room. The guy pulling / blowing fibre, splicing it, building and placing fibre into trays is not an expert on all things availability and policy. If they were they wouldn't be working in the cold on poles and in chambers. They are proficient in the physical commissioning.

I'm good at my job. I have some knowledge from past jobs. I am an enthusiastic amateur in other things but know many more qualified people working in these fields I can tap for knowledge.

That said: I am capable of research and know verifiably utter bobbins when I see it.

  • CarlThomas
  • 10 months ago

Hi Broadband Watchers.
The problem is on the Post Code (GPS Position ) if a spare address is entered on the BT Checker.

  • Blackmamba
  • 10 months ago

The scale of addressing:

+29,000 - Additional delivery points added to PAF this month
30,688,800 - Total number of actual Delivery Points on PAF
1,765,422 - Total number of Postcodes on PAF
1,500 - Total number of Post Towns on PAF
1,312,637 - Total number of business names held on PAF

  • Somerset
  • 10 months ago

Hi Somerset.
Thanks for the above.
The total each month on the new post codes is the most important is required to be down load to each ISP.

  • Blackmamba
  • 10 months ago

@BM - please repost as a sentence we can understand.

  • Somerset
  • 10 months ago

Hi Somerset. Suddenly Post Codes have become in Vogue 1000+.

  • Blackmamba
  • 10 months ago

@BM - postcodes mean nothing, other than a collection of properties. A utility provider is only interested in properties.

  • Somerset
  • 10 months ago

Hi Somerset. The Post Code List was given to me at the Dorking meeting for the broadband in Surrey this in turn gives the addresses. On many new builds they are registered as PLOTS and change when the person moves in. When moving house the customer may take their old address with them so it is better to use the OFCom one.

  • Blackmamba
  • 10 months ago

@BM - which Dorking meeting? How can you take an old address? As said the Ofcom data comes from OR etc.

  • Somerset
  • 10 months ago

@BM
"When moving house the customer may take their old address with them so it is better to use the OFCom [sic] one". Are your sure? How can I take my old address at, say, 1 Acacia Avenue, with me when I move to a house on a new plot at 22 New Road in a different area? Ditto the postcode? Presumably you can point to a Post Office / Royal Mail document that describes the process for this?

Regarding the Ofcom list, as Somerset states, this is obviously based on input collected from the network operators not the other way round, so cannot be more accurate that the source data.

  • New_Londoner
  • 10 months ago

The Dorking meeting I believe referred to was one ahead of the Superfast Surrey project, so some years ago now.

How they had a postcode list for what would be built both from the BDUK project and commercially over the next few years no idea. The intervention area would have been defined but that is NOT the list of where the projects actually built or did not build.

  • andrew
  • thinkbroadband staff
  • 10 months ago

Hi Broadband Watchers. Until ISP,s use OfComs Dbase they will have problems locating the correct information.

  • Blackmamba
  • 10 months ago

@BM
To clarify, again, there is *no* Ofcom database that the ISPs can use. Ofcom's database if simply a collation of date from the network providers, it isn't something that Ofcom has produced itself. That is why Ofcom's data is always less accurate than that if the ISPs, it's invariably a few months out of date.

Now please explain how what you mean by "when moving house the customer may take their old address with them so it is better to use the OFCom one" and how exactly it is possible to take an old address with you to a new location, something which appears completely illogical.

  • New_Londoner
  • 10 months ago

@BM - why do you not read?

Again, Ofcom say 'The checker should not be regarded as providing a definitive view and we plan to update the data later in the year.' So why should an ISP use it when the definitive information is from the network operators.

Again, what is this about 'taking an old address'?

Again, why do you think any organisation like Openreach would use imperial measurements?

  • Somerset
  • 10 months ago

Would love to see an alternative network like CityFibre bring FTTP to Canterbury. I've always found it odd that a city with three universities and about 60,000 residents has absolutely no FTTP projects, besides a couple of small new-builds. The town is also quite small and densely populated so I would think it would be a reasonably good location.

Openreach are bringing Fibre First to Broadstair and Ramsagte which both have smaller populations.

  • shadowrider921009
  • 10 months ago

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