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2.6 GHz spectrum to be reserved for London 2012 Olympics
Monday 23 August 2010 18:09:08 by John Hunt

Ofcom have published a consultation today on the use of the 2.6 GHz spectrum for the London 2012 Olympic Games. This band of spectrum made up of 2500-2960 MHz has been in use for wireless camera operation but is expected to be auctioned off next year for use as mobile broadband spectrum. This would increase the capacity available to operators to allow them to introduce new services such as WiMAX or Long Term Evolution (LTE), a next-generation mobile broadband technology.

Ofcom is now proposing that the 2.6 GHz band be reserved for continued use for wireless cameras during the period of the Olympic Games in London. This is as they expect there to be more demand for spectrum than their original proposals based on the Vancouver Winter Olympics and an increase in use of technology like 3DTV.

This may have some affect on mobile broadband operators as it affectively limits them from deploying in this frequency range until after the Olympics have completed. The restrictions would apply from the 28th of June 2012 to 23rd of September 2012 and would be in the area bounded by the M25 motorway. Ofcom, however, don't expect much opposition to this consultation as mobile operators at not expected to be ready to deploy until after this time. This is partly due to an upgrade programme for a neighbouring frequency range (radars operating at 2.7 GHz). There is also the possibility for some licenses being granted for trials of mobile or broadband data services during the Games if they can be co-ordinated with the wireless camera use.

Overall, this points at new faster mobile broadband services using this spectrum not being on the horizon until late 2012 at the very earliest, although deployments could start away from London before this, assuming the radar upgrades have been completed (which doesn't look likely by this date). The consultation is open for responses for 4 weeks ending 17th September 2010.

Comments

Posted by otester over 6 years ago
So the signal is going to be even worse than 3G?

Not looking good!

What about the lower bands that are due to be auctioned off?
Posted by cyberdoyle over 6 years ago
try as they might, we could easily end up as a laughing stock when the olympics are on. The infrastructure could collapse. Bring on some fibre. Moral and optic.
Posted by New_Londoner over 6 years ago
I suspect there will be loads of fibre to the venues, don't imagine this will affect the running of the games.
Posted by GMAN99 over 6 years ago
Oh there's plenty of fibre going in for this:- http://www.btplc.com/BTLondon2012/Whatweredoingandwhy/2012GamesBTcasestudy.pdf
Posted by cyberdoyle over 6 years ago
thanks GMANN, looks like BT are pulling out all the stops for the venues. Won't save the folk on the dodgy connections though. The rest of the country may get a nasty shock if the ISPs don't buy more feed... even if they do the copper and the exchanges may melt. I think its gonna be massive.
Posted by Somerset over 6 years ago
cd - what do you mean about copper and exchanges melting - please explain, but don't get too technical.
Posted by djfunkdup over 6 years ago
“It is inconceivable that we could
deliver the 2012 Games without
BT on board. We needed someone
we can trust, who could provide
the technical know-how and the
creative solutions to ensure our
London 2012 Games are the very
best they can be. BT gives us this.”
Sebastian Coe
LOCOG Chair
The London Organising Committee of the Olympic Games....lol now that did make me pmsl....
Posted by CARPETBURN over 6 years ago
^^^ LOL someone should tell him BT are not quite as good with 1500m distances as he was :D
Posted by GMAN99 over 6 years ago
Why did it make you laugh dj?
Posted by cyberdoyle over 6 years ago
Gmann99 it made me laugh too. actually. its funny.

Peter I mean the exchanges will be overworked during the Olympics. Its gonna be big. I don't see how all the data is going to get through. They can't cope at peak times at the moment. I think both landline and mobile is going to have issues. Don't you?
Posted by TaRkADaHl over 6 years ago
The people laughing clearly have no idea how involved/experianced BT is in large scale communications world wide with Radianz and MPLS etc etc...

This is a very different ball game to what you have experianced with Indian call centres, copper lines and rubbish cheap consumer products.
Posted by Somerset over 6 years ago
cd - can i suggest that you do not have the knowledge and experience to be able to offer an opinion on this?
Posted by GMAN99 over 6 years ago
@Tark, exactly, most of the people on here's experience with BT is for a phone package, internet provide or both, they've no idea how or where they fit (and how well they do) as a global communications provider and in how many countries they operate.
Posted by TaRkADaHl over 6 years ago
@cd - the UK network/backhaul is more than capable of coping with this, providers just need to provision/rent more throughput with their suppliers.

During the big england game one of the nodes in London was dealing with almost 30Gbps and it never exploded or died.

If people are willing to pay for the backhaul space, it is available already.
Posted by CARPETBURN over 6 years ago
quote"@cd - the UK network/backhaul is more than capable of coping with this, providers just need to provision/rent more throughput with their suppliers.

During the big england game one of the nodes in London was dealing with almost 30Gbps and it never exploded or died.

If people are willing to pay for the backhaul space, it is available already."

You better tell BT retail that...

http://www.thinkbroadband.com/news/4283-world-cup-office-hours-internet-traffic-increases.html

Big England game no problems, oh really..... Go peddle that nonsense elsewhere.
Posted by TaRkADaHl over 6 years ago
@CB nothing there states that BT's backhaul died.

If ISP's wanted more bandwidth, they could have easily provisioned it.

All of this was caused by traffic shaping and the limited bandwidth that ISP's were paying for being over saturated.
Posted by New_Londoner over 6 years ago
Interesting comments from all but what exactly do ISPs have to do with the provision of bandwidth at the Olympic venues for LOCOG and the OBS?

As mentioned above, better comparisons are with some the private networks provided to many global companies. I'm not aware of these suffering problems as the customers pay for the bandwidth that they need.

Posted by New_Londoner over 6 years ago
I've not seen anything to suggest there are concerns about bandwidth for the games. The only concerns I've read about have been regarding lack of 3G capacity, which affects many large-scale public events - ask anyone trying to call from the V Festivals over the weekend!
Posted by cyberdoyle over 6 years ago
I don't think the problem is with the backhaul, think that's all through fibre anyway. The problem is in the connectivity available to the consumer. Good ISPs monitor it constantly and buy more at certain times. But you pay more for the better service. The bulk of the population is on the cheaper products. They are really going to suffer. mobile and landline.
Posted by otester over 6 years ago
3G will only be affected in and around the areas of London.

I personally doubt the demand for bandwidth will be anywhere near that of the England games.

Even so, if you pay peanuts you get peanuts.

I won't be affected.
Posted by CARPETBURN over 6 years ago
quote"@CB nothing there states that BT's backhaul died."

Where did i claim it did?
Its clear though unlike what you stated it isnt "more than capable of coping"
Posted by CARPETBURN over 6 years ago
Unless of course its more than capable and ISPs including BT Retail just gave their customers high pings and sudden speed drops by choice.
Posted by TaRkADaHl over 6 years ago
@CB - I stated that the backhaul is more than capable of coping, it had 30Gbps going through it and it didn't die. You replied with:

"no problems, oh really..... Go peddle that nonsense elsewhere".

You don't quite seem to understand... the backhaul was fine, no issues.

The issue was that ISP's only rented a limited amount of bandwidth, which was in this case, not enough. As a result, people were getting heavilty traffic shaped causing all of the issues people were seeing.
Posted by Somerset over 6 years ago
cd - core network is all fibre, so you don't need to think. But, again, it's the bandwidth available not how it's delivered that matters. Please get away from the 'it's got to be fibre' only way of thinking when router and server capacity is just as important.
Posted by New_Londoner over 6 years ago
I really don't see what relevance the bandwidth that ISPs purchase to support their customers has to do with the fibre network that will be provided to the Olympic venues? This has no more to do with ISPs than the networks for Reuters etc.

Suspect people are getting their (fibre) wires crossed!
Posted by Somerset over 6 years ago
NL - no surprise there.

cd - you get what you pay for!
Posted by CARPETBURN over 6 years ago
quote"The issue was that ISP's only rented a limited amount of bandwidth, which was in this case, not enough. As a result, people were getting heavilty traffic shaped causing all of the issues people were seeing."

If people cant access anything because ISPs dont buy enough bandwidth then whether the core network is capable or not seems irrelevant. A ferrari may be capable of 200Mph, not going to happen on a country road or traffic jam though is it.
Posted by CARPETBURN over 6 years ago
Core BT network capable or not, as i pointed out BT Retail thereself suffered when England games happened. A football match is only 90mins, how long does the Olympics last, err just a bit longer, lets see if you are happy to say the core network is capable when/if your internet grinds to a halt for potentially 2 Weeks.
Posted by GMAN99 over 6 years ago
CB I think you are overrating the Olympic interest to be honest, how many people will be watching events daily on their PC's in work? Not that many I would say.

Don't get me wrong, I think it will be great but its not the huge massive down tools event like the world cup England games, when England went out of the World Cup I should imagines ISP's were scrambling over themselves to sell back their bandwidth ;o)
Posted by TaRkADaHl over 6 years ago
CB - are you working on the assumption that BT Retail purchase more backhaul space than anyone else or get priority access becuase they are 'linked' to BTW? You seem to be...

The core network is more than capable of sustaining anything you want, if you need it and can afford it, I can tell you how to get a 10Gbps private line, which will not ever slow down. Do you really think BT would offer this if the network wasn't able to cope?
Posted by CARPETBURN over 6 years ago
quote"CB I think you are overrating the Olympic interest to be honest, how many people will be watching events daily on their PC's in work? Not that many I would say."

You may end up being right and i may be completely wrong, i have no issue admitting that. Im just saying if it is popular core network superb or not it didnt help the world cup games and it wont help this.
Posted by CARPETBURN over 6 years ago
quote"CB - are you working on the assumption that BT Retail purchase more backhaul space than anyone else or get priority access becuase they are 'linked' to BTW? You seem to be..."

No im suggesting they should be purchasing more as they have more customers to supply that bandwidth to compared to many ISPs. Whether people can get 10Gbps lines or not is also irrelevant as most dont have them.
The core network capable or not doesnt even come into matters. If everyone wants to watch your connection will slow, end of story no matter how great you think the core network is.
Posted by New_Londoner over 6 years ago
Some interesting observations but the original point was whether "the infrastructure would collapse", which has nothing whatsoever to do with any ISP bandwidth.

The key infrastructure in question is the network within and between the Olympic venues for use by LOCOG and the Olympic Broadcasting Service. The former will ensure that the games run smoothly, the latter that pictures are available to broadcasters globally.

Neither require ISP involvement, I thik people are getting confused.
Posted by CARPETBURN over 6 years ago
And again thats all pointless if you cant watch it the other end. A ferrari cant go 200mph on a country lane, a gallong of water can not fit into a litre jug and oddles of network bandwidth isnt supplied by any ISP, so core network for the viewers which i would had thought is pretty important for such a sporting event is pointless.
Posted by CARPETBURN over 6 years ago
I have 10 million pounds you can have 1p a day... You will never get all of it or any significant value from me.... Do i need provide more stupid examples. To show the core network is pointless if it isnt delivered or used.
Posted by New_Londoner over 6 years ago
@CB
As above, the point was that the infrastructure would not cope, this is not correct. Who cares whether your ISP has enough bandwidth it will make no difference to the network being supplied for the games, nor for the network being supplied for the Olympic broadcaster.

You may or may not be correct about your ISP, but that was not the point being made previously. So no examples needed, not relevant to this discussion.
Posted by CARPETBURN over 6 years ago
^^^ Id say it will be very relevant once the BT adverts about watching the olympics start.
Still that will be another for the ASA to deal with. LOL
Posted by Legolash2o over 6 years ago
Knowing BT.... They will link the stadium using their BET technology and throttle the rest of us :P

Nah they will install a dedicated fibre line to the stadium most probably.
Posted by Somerset over 6 years ago
Lego - read the case study. The Olympics network has nothing to do with ADSL to the home.
Posted by Legolash2o over 6 years ago
The BET and throttling thing was a joke, i know they wouldn't do that.

"nothing to do with ADSL to the home." Hence why i said "dedicated fibre".
Posted by CARPETBURN over 6 years ago
"Watch the olympics ondemand and catchup on your BT Vision box".... I can see the ads now and the new ASA complaints LOL
Posted by New_Londoner over 6 years ago
Not relevant to the network to run the games, and anyway isn't the BBC is the national broadcaster for 2012 in the UK?
Posted by CARPETBURN over 6 years ago
Yep and BT vision have iplayer and BBC ondemand services coming. Which will slow to a crawl just like it did with football.
In the build up to the olympics we will no doubt have TV adverts from that soppy Kris Marshall his tart and new born barsteward child telling us all about BT Vision. Im waiting for the ad when they finally get married and the idiot tells us to trust putting the wedding video online. Thats probably coming soon also, mark my words, BT tv ads are soooo predictable.
Posted by New_Londoner over 6 years ago
As before, interesting comments to some perhaps, but not at all relevant to the subject in hand. I assume that means that you've doen background reading now and realise that ISP contention etc is completely separate to the network being supplied for the 2012 games.
Posted by CARPETBURN over 6 years ago
I never denied the core network wasnt capable of delivering i stated what we get our end is to all purposes... Pathetic! I thought i used enough illustrative examples, obviously not.
Posted by CARPETBURN over 6 years ago
You could have a "core" network capable of broadcasting it all live to the moon, doesnt matter a jot if the ISPs aint gonna buy and supply the bandwidth to anyone living there.

Its like me saying i have a core business which has unlimited stock...... Its unlimited because i dont give anyone any of the stock no matter how much cash they offer.
Posted by New_Londoner over 6 years ago
Actually CB these are two entirely separate markets, to extend your metaphor.

The network that is supplied to help deliver the Olympics and provide TV to the various broadcasters around the world is in no way dependent on what UK ISPs decide to do, and vice versa.

They serve entirely different purposes, so whether or not your ISP is able to support your needs during the Games, be that for streaming TV or for running your business, has no bearing on whether the BBC can get pictures from the Olympic Broadcast Service.
Posted by New_Londoner over 6 years ago
The original point, no doubt forgotten, made by CD, was that "the infrastructure [for the Games] could collapse", which is highly unlikely - as explained by me and others it is totally different to that used by ISPs.
Posted by CARPETBURN over 6 years ago
^^ I spose it depends on what you mean by infrastructure, personally id include delivery methods and quality of the delivery in that
Posted by New_Londoner over 6 years ago
@CB
I agree with your point, however delivery methods and quality of delivery for the 2012 infrastructure has nothing to do with broadband or with ISPs.
Posted by CARPETBURN over 6 years ago
Quality of whats deliveered over the net nothing to do with ISPs? Well thats a new one, all ISPs and delivery methods employed for the content the same are they?
Posted by New_Londoner over 6 years ago
That's the point though - the 2012 Games will NOT be delivered over the net. AS sveral of us have pointed out, the infrastructure that will run the games, deliver TV to the broadcasters etc has nothing to do with ISPs.

Clearly some ISPs will stream video etc, but that is not what is being used to run the games, provide broadcast TV etc. Two completely different things, hopefully clear enough?
Posted by Somerset over 6 years ago
cb - do you think ISPs and the internet has anything to do with links from the Olympics to broadcasters?
Posted by CARPETBURN over 6 years ago
Its all infrastructure. As i said the core network may well be there in place. If the customer has issues theie end though no matter what or whos fault it is then the core network doesnt really matter if its good or bad if the performance the user end is always bad anyway.
A courier company can have a superb core network with millions of offices and delivery vans. If the driver of a van to deliver the goods to your home though is a slow and idle so and so you dont get the goods for days. No matter how many offices vans and capable they are, it all becomes redundant.
Posted by New_Londoner over 6 years ago
@CB
Not sure that you understand that the infrastructure required to help run the 2012 games, and to deliver TV to the broadcasters has nothing to do with domestic ISPs in the UK.

Using your example above, its a bit like having two courier companies. The performance of the first one has no bearing on the second and vice versa, as they are two entirely separate businesses.
Posted by CARPETBURN over 6 years ago
^^^ Thats nothing like my example and only involves half the equation.
Posted by New_Londoner over 6 years ago
@CB
Actually its the other way round - your example was not relevant to the point being made, as explained above.
Posted by CARPETBURN over 6 years ago
Of course it was, maybe you need it explained...
A courier company can have a superb core network with millions of offices and delivery vans. If the driver of a van to deliver the goods to your home though is a slow and idle so and so you dont get the goods for days. No matter how many offices vans and capable they are, it all becomes redundant.

Courier company = core network
Driver = delivery to home user
Not getting goods for days = The slow crawl the olympics will go at.

I thought even an idiot could follow that example, obviously i was wrong.
Posted by New_Londoner over 6 years ago
@CB
SAdly you've missed the point yet again.

As many people have tried to explain to you, for the purposes of the networks required to support the delivcery of the Olympic games, as well as to deliver content to broadcasters, there is no delivery to home users!

As numerous posts above have highlighted, broadband ISPs (or drivers in your example) are not involved! Hope this clears up your confusion.
Posted by CARPETBURN over 6 years ago
NO you are missing the point. Infrastructure is infrastructure, if there is a weak link in the chain anywhere its pointless being strong elsewhere....... Nobody sat at home gives a flying toss about core network at the games, all people care about is getting the content.
Posted by New_Londoner over 6 years ago
Sorry CB but, as above, this has no bearing whatsoever whether the infrastructure being supplied to run the games, no that to deliver content to broadcasters, is fit for purpose.

To repeat what has been stated before, whether your ISP has sufficient connectivity so you can watch the games via your Canvas box rather than terrestial TV is of no consqeuence to the infrastructure being provided for the games themselves.
Posted by New_Londoner over 6 years ago
Contd.

It may come as a surprise, but I suspect that neither the organisers nor the competitors will be that fussed if Mr Carpetburn is unable to view the games online due to a problem with yoru ISP!
Posted by CARPETBURN over 6 years ago
quote"Sorry CB but, as above, this has no bearing whatsoever whether the infrastructure being supplied to run the games, no that to deliver content to broadcasters, is fit for purpose."

Now ya just speaking gobbly gook
Posted by CARPETBURN over 6 years ago
quote"To repeat what has been stated before, whether your ISP has sufficient connectivity so you can watch the games via your Canvas box rather than terrestial TV is of no consqeuence to the infrastructure being provided for the games themselves."

What canvas box?? The specs for that garbage are not even finalised, you really have no clue
Posted by CARPETBURN over 6 years ago
quote"It may come as a surprise, but I suspect that neither the organisers nor the competitors will be that fussed if Mr Carpetburn is unable to view the games online due to a problem with yoru ISP!"

Ill have plenty of bandwidth just like i did for the footie and just as several LLU customers did, but thanks for the concern.
Posted by New_Londoner over 6 years ago
@CB
Note you're not now dealing with the actual issue, so assume you've finally worked out that the broadband issues you've raised repeatedly have no bearing on the infrastructure being supplied to run the games, nor on that to deliver content to broadcasters.

At last! :-)
Posted by CARPETBURN over 6 years ago
The issue for me and most will be what the performance is like at their computer, attempting to access Olympic news and video... Mine will be fine, you on the other hand have already admitted in a story elsewhere your connection suffers bad contention and thats why it doesnt run at its full rate LOL
Posted by New_Londoner over 6 years ago
Sorry CB, not what I said, and irrelevant anyway.

Yet again, trying to explain to you that the experience of you or I, should we want to "access Olympic news and video", will have no bearing on the infrastructure being used to run the Games, nor on that used to gather video material and supply it to broadcasters.
Posted by CARPETBURN over 6 years ago
quote"Sorry CB, not what I said, and irrelevant anyway."

Your connection suffering from contention irrelevant? Ok as long as you are happy LOL
Posted by New_Londoner over 6 years ago
To repeat, sorry CB, not what I said, and irrelevant anyway - suggest read response in the relevant thread.

In the meantime, the fact you'e now raising irrelevencies tells me that you may finally have grasped the point being made above and worked out that the infrastructure being used to run the Games, and that being used to gather video material and supply it to broadcasters is competely different to that used by ISPs.
Posted by CARPETBURN over 6 years ago
I never said anywhere that infrastructure at the games itself wasnt capable, i just said to a degree its poinless thing to discuss.
Oh and ive read the other thread...... That still isnt full speed, ive seen 38.xx Mb results and even if your latest test was max speed on the downstream it isnt on the upload, therefore you defending that user still means you still need to post a test with "FULL" speed.
Posted by sandymacrae over 6 years ago
What is overlooked in discussions about re-assigning frequencies from broadcasters to mobile data services is that the broadcasters most likely provide the content that the data services distribute. The 800 MHz band is extensively used by program makers for radiomics and associated equipment. Ofcom are clearing these users by the end of 2012. Program makers will need these frequencies to cover the Olympic Games. It is doubtful if the UK could mount an event on this scale again because of the future shortages of suitable frequencies for program making as they are sold off to data services.
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