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BT Q4 results show decline in revenue and 15,000 more job cuts
Thursday 14 May 2009 12:44:54 by John Hunt

BT's Q4 results released today show revenue up by 1% to £5.4bn for the quarter ending 31st March 2009, £21.4bn for entire year. Whilst being a 1% increase, this is largely due foreign exchange movements and acquisitions. Putting these aside, revenue fell by 5% largely due to BT Global Services.

"Three out of four of BT's lines of business have performed well in spite of fierce competition and the global economic downturn. However this achievement has been overshadowed by the unacceptable performance of BT Global Services and the resulting charges we have taken. During the year we have changed the leadership of BT Global Services and started to turn the division around."

Ian Livingston, (Chief Executive) BT Group

BT retail saw a 3% revenue decline to £2,101m driven by a fall in calls and lines, with some offset from a growth in BT conferencing, BT vision and mobility. BT Vision now reaches 423,000 customers. BT Openzone minutes also increased by 80% compared with the same quarter last year, up to 120 million minutes. A good sign from the consumer division was a £2 increase in revenue per customer (based on 12 month rolling average) up to £287 reflective of customers buying multiple services. Market share of broadband for BT Retail stayed at 34% with 99,000 net additions in the quarter with a total of 4.8 million customers.

BT Wholesale also saw a revenue decline, down by 2% to £1,151m, partly due to a continued migration away from their broadband services to LLU. Openreach saw a net addition of 200,000 external LLU lines bringing the total to 5.7 million. Wholesale Line Rental (WLR) also increased by 300,000 up to 5.6 million. The BT 21CN network is now available to over 10 million homes, and this number is increasing steadily.

In hopes to save costs, 15,000 jobs are expected to be cut this year which it hopes will be via natural churn or voluntary redundancies, compounding the 15,000 that have already been cut in the last year. With a final dividend expected of 6.5p, down from 15.8p last year, shareholders will be keen to see saving made wherever possible.

[ Topic: Broadband | 52 comments | link to this item ]
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Posted by CARPETBURN 10 months ago
quote"BT Q4 results show decline in revenue and 15,000 more job cuts"

Oh well never mind... Back to news we care about
Posted by cyberdoyle 10 months ago
this is news we should care about actually. It isn't the mens fault that the fatcats and shareholders want to wring even more money out of an obsolete copper network. At this moment in time they should be doubling the workforce not cutting it! they should take on all the unemployed tradesmen and grafters out there and get the infrastructure upgraded to fibre to the home FttH so that none of us need worry or moan again. Govt intervention is needed.
Posted by GMAN99 10 months ago
That's not why they are in trouble its because the fat cats promised the city they'd make huge unrealistic profits , which they couldn't deliver. Its only one part of the business that has caused this
Posted by GMAN99 10 months ago
And if you don't care about people losing jobs from any company (whether you love of loathe them) well... your comments speak volumes about you.
Posted by c_j_ 10 months ago
It's Global Services that have made most of the loss, through fiascos like ConnectingForHealth (what should we expect when MS and BT get together)?

Is it Global Services managers that are going to take the hit? Are there 15,000 of them? Hmmm, how does that work then?
Posted by c_j_ 10 months ago
grr meant to say "when MS and BT get together to fleece the taxpayer"
Posted by CARPETBURN 10 months ago
quote"And if you don't care about people losing jobs from any company (whether you love of loathe them) well... your comments speak volumes about you."

And your comments speak volumes about how they have nobody to blame but thereself. Bad investments and people choosing to use other services because they are better is not my fault, those same better services have seen internal expansion and customer growth, someone has to loose out and tough luck its BT, sorry but why should i care, they have had things their own way for too long. Its nice to see them fail and others succeed for a change.
Posted by Aqualung 10 months ago
as usual people at the bottom who are needed get the chop while those at the top who made the mistakes and are basically not needed stay.

"The BT 21CN network is now available to over 10 million homes, and this number is increasing steadily." it might be available but it doesnt work properly with migrations to it frozen now by Entanet who were the original flag bearers for the system.
Posted by GMAN99 10 months ago
I'm afraid you've not idea what your talking about Carpet its just random BT bashing. The reason they are in trouble isn't because of their products and people going elsewhere its a minority of idiot managers (some right at the top/or where) who are to blame, not the 15000 people paying for stupid management mistakes.
Posted by GMAN99 10 months ago
As for why should you care, well if anyone is going to bring faster broadband to the masses (however long that takes) it will be BT and no-one else so you should care in that respect? Even if you don't for the poor people getting laid off.
Posted by AndrueC 10 months ago
@Carpetburn, Reasons to care:

* The people losing their jobs are not to blame. They are mostly doing a good job.

* BT's infrastructure continues to underpin the entire country. If they are failing it hurts all of us.
Posted by yobrenoops 10 months ago
However, on the back on these results Openreach (BT) are accelerating the NGA/FTTC rollout from 500k homes to 1 million in the next year.
Posted by Dixinormous 10 months ago
Well considering it apparently and even then it's rather late, should have been done before Virgin started as it is won't even start until Virgin's 50M deployment is finished.

It's unfortunate that the decent people in BT are suffering under a waste of space management. I'm sure it's no coincidence that the only things BT appear to make money with are based around their monopoly / duopoly in fixed line which would be tricky even for them to lose money on.
Posted by Dawn_Falcon 10 months ago
Cyberdoyle - You mean BT should be forced to lose even more cash? It's government rules that bleeds them dry and sucks away cash which should of been used for infrastructure in the first place!

Dixi - Tricky, before you consider the mass of legislation and regulation they have to deal with, yea.
Posted by Dixinormous 10 months ago
Well Dawn given that BT describe their performance in Openreach, Wholesale and Retail as being very good I would say that the legislation and regulation isn't killing them, it's incompetent maangement that seems to achieve that.

As was mentioned on TV last night as soon as they step outside their comfort zone and there's no monopoly/duopoly propping them up they seem to hit issues.

Hard to find a telco to compare BT with, others seem to have significant mobile/fixed operations and/or infrastructure outside their incumbent region.
Posted by GMAN99 10 months ago
quote "As was mentioned on TV last night as soon as they step outside their comfort zone and there's no monopoly/duopoly propping them up they seem to hit issues." Just goes to show what you/press and others know about BT as a business. They've been doing this "other stuff" successfully for years. Its not all blokes up poles and hasn't been for a long time, that's just one area of the business.
Posted by GMAN99 10 months ago
Global Services is a (hence the name) worldwide business and has been doing very well and nothing to do with the core phones/broadband/circuits business. Just some bad calls by some bad people most of which have now moved on after a getting a rosey handshake.

So as for this comfort zone your talking about they've been operating outside it for many years with no issues and doing very well.
Posted by Dixinormous 10 months ago
Now I am confused. On one side I'm being told BT are doing very well, on the other they are being choked by regulation and unable to make any money.

I'm seeing words like naive, inexperienced and BT commenting on the 'higher-margin UK business' where they can leverage incumbency.

How much of Global's business actually comes from UK based business I wonder.
Posted by CARPETBURN 10 months ago
quote"Global Services is a (hence the name) worldwide business and has been doing very well"

LMAO oh thats why 700million is going to be cut in that area, yeah its doing greeeat.

quote"Now I am confused. On one side I'm being told BT are doing very well, on the other they are being choked by regulation and unable to make any money."

Just another day full of fanboy gibberish and tripe from BTs own lips.
Posted by GMAN99 10 months ago
"Has" been doing very well.. /rolleyes
Posted by CARPETBURN 10 months ago
quote""Has" been doing very well.. /rolleyes"

Yeah it "HAS" been doing so well they are going to make huge cutbacks in that area to recoup revenue.... Yeah it "HAS" done soooooo well its not part of the reason for the mass losses at all.... /Skips the rolling eyes bit and just points and laughs at the BT lover... Honestly BT defenders here get funnier by the day
Posted by GMAN99 10 months ago
My response was to Dixi's comments about BT failing when outside this so called comfort zone of core telecomms. When in fact they've been outside this "zone" for over 12yrs and done really well. As I've already said it was mismanagement a few years back that got GS in a mess. Up until then GS were doing great and actually keeping other parts of the business afloat.
Posted by GMAN99 10 months ago
...and BT bashers get less funnier by the day.
Posted by Somerset 10 months ago
Someone had an unpleasant experience in a BT phone box once...
Posted by CARPETBURN 10 months ago
quote"...and BT bashers get less funnier by the day. "

Who said any of them were trying to be funny? Most of them speak the truth, IE, BT is naff

quote"Someone had an unpleasant experience in a BT phone box once... "

Lucky in my area if every other one you come across even works, let alone spending time in it.
Posted by Dawn_Falcon 10 months ago
Dixi - Yea, strange GLOBAL services where regulation dosn't strangle them has been doing very well. Of course, because of the core regulation strangled business they're even having to cut back there. The money for innovation and expansion is tied up in said regulation.
Posted by Dixinormous 10 months ago
@Dawn - Errr unless I'm much mistaken the 'core regulation strangled' business made money unlike the global services where regulation didn't strangle. I also question how well they actually did internationally once the advantages of being UK ILEC are taken into account. GS made a 134mn operating loss last year?
Posted by CARPETBURN 10 months ago
quote"GS made a 134mn operating loss last year?"

Oh no no no, you cant say that its BT bashing dont you know, GS 'HAS' (whatever that means) been doing well..... 134mil, loss pfffft thats nothing to worry about its very good LOL (sarcasm off)
Posted by Dixinormous 10 months ago
Oddly given that regulation doesn't strangle them GS actually made less operating profit and lower EBITDA in 2008 than Retail, Wholesale or Openreach despite having the 2nd highest revenue. Openreach being the largest contributor or operating profit to the group. Most regulated arm.. largest operating profit. All 3 regulated arms had better operating profit and EBITDA margins than GS in FY2008 too. Strange that, given the crushing effect of regulation, the 3 regulated businesses made more money.
Posted by CARPETBURN 10 months ago
^^^ Err i was agreeing with you
Posted by browst 10 months ago
I feel for the decent people losing their jobs (who wouldn't) but when a company keep you on hold for 20 minutes then want to charge £122 when you try to go back to using them, it's difficult to feel sorry.
Posted by CARPETBURN 10 months ago
quote"when a company keep you on hold for 20 minutes then want to charge £122 when you try to go back to using them, it's difficult to feel sorry."

OMG tell me that isnt true or involved an actual new line to the premises.
Posted by GMAN99 10 months ago
Openreach do the reconnection and AFAIK like most companies they don't do stuff for free
Posted by CARPETBURN 10 months ago
quote"Openreach do the reconnection and AFAIK like most companies they don't do stuff for free"

LMAO oh so you defend a price of £122 for a man walking up a ladder and connecting a piece of cable?
Funny sky dont even charge that amount for a dish install, and even Virgin dont charge this amount and they often have to not only lay the cable but dig a hole to get it to your front door. Nice try at defending BT again though you score 10/10 for entertainment value.
Posted by GMAN99 10 months ago
So do you know EXACTLY what is involved in a connection and how must it costs? How much does it cost to pay said man to travel to said ladder and how much for the cable, drilling, fitting NTU. What about the work done in the exchange or do the magic pixies take care of that for free? I'm not saying its worth it or VFM, but you have no idea what is involved at what cost, but you don't need to bash randomly of course..
Posted by GMAN99 10 months ago
@browst AFAIK if you have dial tone you won't get charged that fee, its only if your line has to be reconnected proper. Also I don't know if you know but there is an offer on reconnects until the end of June, its free if you take up an 18month contract.
Posted by Somerset 10 months ago
SKy and VM get all the income from the customer unlike BT/Openreach.
Posted by GMAN99 10 months ago
Please don't disturb the man with facts like that, he's too busy with his hammer for facts to be of relevance
Posted by CARPETBURN 10 months ago
Quote"So do you know EXACTLY what is involved in a connection and how must it costs? How much does it cost to pay said man to travel to said ladder"

Well obviously BT claim its more expensive to send a bloke up a ladder than Sky or Virgin do.

quote"What about the work done in the exchange or do the magic pixies take care of that for free?"

Virgin have to connect cables to their cabinets as well as your home...... They can do it cheaper though
Posted by CARPETBURN 10 months ago
quote"I'm not saying its worth it or VFM, but you have no idea what is involved at what cost, but you don't need to bash randomly of course.."

Rubbish you are defending an out of touch organisation that so obviously overcharges, Virgin on occasions will hook you up for free, that requires work not only at your home but the cabinet and their headquarters. If BT and openreach dont get all the profit from that £122 charge who does? How long does it take to wire up a cable? Couple of hours at most? £61 an hour nice work if you can rip people off
Posted by GMAN99 10 months ago
You really don't get it do you? Somerset is saying that Virgin/Sky can get away with charging a lower install cost because they will directly reap the ongoing monies from the customer. With Openreach a line can be put in and talk talk/post office etc can take the line over so they (BT) never see any further monies just the install charge. God your business sense is blinkered...
Posted by CARPETBURN 10 months ago
RUBBISH AGAIN..... Sky could install a satelite dish and you could use it for freesat so they no longer make cash from you.

Also doesnt BT things like new lines come with 12 months contract??? (Talk talk aint gonna take over a new line for atleast 12 months unless like an idiot you want to pay them and BT or pay BT to get out of contract). Are you seriously saying they cant make back £122 in 12 months???? LMAO do me a favour... Me no business sense??? Hahaha you havent any concept of cash or predicted earnings within a business or finacees over a 12 month period. RUN ALONG BT LOON
Posted by CARPETBURN 10 months ago
Maybe you forgot a new line at a cost of £122.50 ties you to 12 months line rental from BT also.
Posted by GMAN99 10 months ago
"Sky could install a satelite dish and you could use it for freesat so they no longer make cash from you"

So a Sky install costs £30. Are you telling me you can have a dish installed for £30 by Sky and you don't have to sign up to any contract or take any of their channels and can go straight to freeview, all for £30? No I think you'll find it costs £117.45
Posted by CARPETBURN 10 months ago
quote"Are you telling me you can have a dish installed for £30 by Sky and you don't have to sign up to any contract or take any of their channels and can go straight to freeview, all for £30? No I think you'll find it costs £117.45"

FAIL again it costs £75 OR LESS http://tinyurl.com/qf9gao (£73.40 direct from sky for now). That includes a Dish install a box install and 4 months worth of entertainment package from Sky......
Posted by CARPETBURN 10 months ago
Lets see thats Hardware to own, cables and dish installed, 4 months free of a normal PAY service for not much more than half of what BT charge for a New bit of copper cable. NO 12 MONTH CONTRACT unlike BT either, if you dont want to pay subscriptions for the TV pack you simply tell them that before your 4 months trial is up. Keep it and you are also eligible for cheap broadband and phone.
LMAO all that for £75 quid... Whats BT give you? £122 for a line, a throttled internet service, a nice homehub MINUS the handset even though you just paid £122 for a PHONE LINE ahhhhh GENIUS!
Posted by Dawn_Falcon 10 months ago
Dixi - If you dig into the numbers, you'll realise that the global business has been badly screwed over by the recession and exchange rates.

And all that the UK business numbers show is that BT might even be able to do well enough to invest more in its infrastructure once you've removed the stranglehold of the regulation and regulator.

Carpet - Well yes, BT can't afford loss leaders because of said stranglehold.
Posted by GMAN99 10 months ago
Fail again? Figures taken direct from their website... (http://tinyurl.com/o5k2xh) I'm not looking for offers. If you want offers BT are doing free installs and waiving the £122 right now... and?
Posted by CARPETBURN 10 months ago
Quote".....I'm not looking for offers."

LMAO Sky pay once watch forever is not an "OFFER" that particular service has been available well over a year... Wake up and smell something other than your BT shares.

quote"If you want offers BT are doing free installs and waiving the £122 right now"

As you think the Sky thing is an offer come back in 12 months and lets see if the BT offer is still going. I bet the Sky one is.

OH and nice fail YET again your link shows Skys phone service is also cheaper, monthly LOL
Posted by CARPETBURN 10 months ago
Oh and sorry for the comment about smelling your shares above, ive just realised you have done such a poor job trying to flog and justify their £122.50 charge that you probably work or did work for them at some point, your attempted sales patter sounds about on par with BTs.
Posted by GMAN99 10 months ago
As I've already stated... I never said it was VFM it isn't! I've stated why a charge exists compared to other companies who subsidise the install cost based on what they recover elsewhere. As there is no reason or reasoning with you.. I'll leave you to rant on.. or even better.. shut up.
Posted by CARPETBURN 10 months ago
quote"As I've already stated... I never said it was VFM it isn't! I've stated why a charge exists compared to other companies who subsidise the install cost based on what they recover elsewhere."

So BT cant recover that cost even though just the 12 months line rental you will have to pay is one of the most expensive for a phone service in the UK. Are you seriously saying that... £122 for new line plus 12 months at a rough £12 (another £144) plus anything you spend on calls in that 12 months doesnt recoup cost of a bit of cable?? Err ok dream on!
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