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Retail pricing for WBC ADSL2+ service starts to emerge
Monday 26 May 2008 23:47:44 by Andrew Ferguson

Entanet has been involved closely in the trials of the new ADSL2+ service from BT Wholesale known as WBC. The service launched officially at the start of May 2008, but to date price information from broadband providers has been scarce. The first Entanet retailers are now announcing products, with ADSL24 listing prices for its ADSL2+ services that will be available soon:

Plan Peak usage allowance Monthly fee
Broadband 3 3GB £11.75
Broadband 10 10GB £14.99
Broadband 35 35GB £19.99
Broadband 160 160GB £49.99
Broadband 250 250GB £72.99

All the plans (including a few we did not list) provide 'up to 24 meg' ADSL2+ speeds, which are highly dependent on the length of your telephone line as the primary factor, along with the quality of the extension wiring in your home. While the fastest speeds may only be available to some 5% of households, a great many will benefit from the up to 1.4Mbps upload speed. This is particularly welcome news for those using VPNs for accessing corporate networks from home or households with multiple people playing online games at once.

The peak and off-peak time windows have changed compared to previous Entanet products. The new peak timeframe is 7am to 1am, but if you need to top-up your peak usage you can do so for between 36p and £1 per gigabyte depending on how much you buy. For an extra £6.99 you can also buy yourself a slightly higher traffic priority across the BT Wholesale network, with more options expected to be available as the products develop.

ADSL24 do highlight on their product page that the service is not fully launched, which is backed up by the other broadband provider who has mentioned prices so far. Andrews & Arnold are keeping pricing of existing standard services, just giving customers the option of switching to the ADSL2+ based service.

Until more providers release pricing the trend will not be totally clear, but it would appear from the ASDL24 pricing that broadband service providers may be able to offer more in terms of inclusive usage compared to existing ADSL products. Though at £49.99 for around 160GB a month, the pricing is around the same as the original 500Kbps service BT launched some eight years ago if you ignore inflation.

We hope that no broadband provider is going to market the new WBC or other ADSL2+ products as being three times faster than ADSL as this will give a false impression to consumers who are already confused by the way broadband is sold. A great many will get better speeds but as we've shown previously the improvement may be small and even if using ADSL2+ compatible hardware, the choice of ADSL2+ device can make a big difference in the connection speed you will achieve.


Posted by Sandgrounder over 8 years ago
Re:- "services that will be available soon"

except for those of us who live in more rural areas - where "soon" means waiting years.
Posted by adslmax over 8 years ago
Very true, waiting for many years before some of use see ADSL2+ probably late 2011 and early 2012 unless BT speed it up and might subject to change. No ADSL2+ for me until 3 years time.
Posted by adslmax over 8 years ago
I do hope the government will tell BT that ADSL2+ must be coverage in UK by 100% by end of 2009 or get heavy fine.
Posted by radar over 8 years ago
ADSLMAX who do you expect to pay for the 100% coverage ?
Posted by pje1979 over 8 years ago
ADSL 24's prices seem pretty good, especially as there is unlimited usage between 1am and 7am. My exchange gets upgraded on 18th August and I'm already on ADSL 24's max service so not too long to wait for me (hopefully)
Posted by jrawle over 8 years ago
At first I thought those usage allowances were daily. Then they would be reasonable. Just what is the point of faster and faster connections when you can't actually use them? You could use up your 3GB monthly allowance in less than 20 minutes with ADSL2+ !! The internet's different to 8 years ago. Allowances aren't moving with the times.
Posted by g-bhxu over 8 years ago
18 hours of peak hours, are they taking the p?

Posted by BU5T4THEJOCK over 8 years ago
Is this information correct?

O2 offer ADSL2+ for just £15 a month with unlimited downloads if you have an o2 pay as you go sim.

Seems exesivly high if O2 can offer it at such low prices, it's only £20 a month for non O2 customers to get 20mg broadband on there LLU system.
Posted by KarlAustin over 8 years ago
@jrawle - Not everyone feels the need to download half the net, I use my PC for 12-16 hours per day, online, including VoIP usage, 7 days a week - I use between 8-15GB per month. I'd upgrade to ADSL2+ given the chance, even though I could download more, I won't, but what I do download should be faster.
Posted by chrysalis over 8 years ago
BT based broadband. "Cheap to buy expensive to use" or maybe "As we raise speeds we decrease your usage" finally "We dont believe in charging for speed, dont like it? move house"
Posted by bosie over 8 years ago
By the time BT rolls this out, the UK will be best known for its slow, over-crowded and unreliable internet no matter where users live in relation to distance from the exchange. Opportunities for new business will simply bypass the UK unless Government steps in now - not in 2009, 10, 11 whatever. ADSL 2+ is just wasting time.
Posted by jrawle over 8 years ago
@KarlAustin: no-one is downloading "half the net". They are enjoying modern content such as video. 3GB will let you download 5 shows from BBC iPlayer or similar per month, and that's without considering all the uploads, seeing as it's P2P (ADSL24 allowances are download+upload). Why do you need ADSL2+ at all? You won't notice any difference for ordinary web pages, e-mail or VoIP (I know as I have ADSL2+ now) 48x the speed and new multimedia content, yet some providers think lower limits than 8 years ago are OK.
Posted by KarlAustin over 8 years ago
A recent survey though, showed that most people weren't downloading lots of video etc. - you forget that the demographic of this site, especially those that contribute is going to be skewed towards more technical users who are likely to use their connection more. I just checked, my parents ADSL didn't even do 1GB last month. As to why I'd want it? Because when I do need to download something larger, I need it as quickly as possible - time is money when you're in business :)
Posted by Rroff over 8 years ago
But VoD and similiar services are becoming more and more mainstream... internet useage is only becoming more and more embraced at the moment...
Posted by tboorman over 8 years ago
The big downside is the reduction in off-peak hours. I'd prefer the weekend being kept off-peak, with there being a sustainable off-peak usage limit.
Posted by comnut over 8 years ago
KarlAustin: If you want to use it for business, you will want 'business broadband' where you PAY for the gauranteed speed and throughput, that in turn PAYS YOU in customer throughput and satisfaction...

The same reason why airlines have 'business class' so that execs can relax and spread out, while doing more business...
Posted by c_j_ over 8 years ago
"I'd prefer the weekend being kept off-peak ... sustainable off-peak usage limit"

Interesting distinction you draw between "off-peak" and "unmetered". Some folk seem to think the two ought to be equivalent. Broadband economics says otherwise.

Anyway, how many hours worth of downloaded video can any one household watch in a day?
Posted by herdwick over 8 years ago
"3GB will let you download 5 shows from BBC iPlayer or similar per month"

so you can either a) use the off-peak period or b) pay more and have 35 GB instead of 3GB.

Not too hard, really.
Posted by jrawle over 8 years ago
@herdwick: I think I'll take c) use a service that doesn't charge an extortionate price for a decent allowance, and download at whatever time I choose

Hope you enjoy getting up at 7am at the weekend to kill iPlayer before its uploading runs you up a huge bill!
Posted by CARPETBURN over 8 years ago
Oh now what was i saying months and months and months back about BT adsl2+ still having silly peak and off peak times and caps.....
50 quid for a 160gig service and top ups in 50 gig amounts at a cost of £22 ROFLMFAO and some here had the nerve to say to me adsl2+ from BT would be cheaper (ouch my sides)....... Hope everyone that cant get alternatives to BT based products enjoy their new superfast connections, well they will for atleast part of a full month LOL
Posted by _TRIaXOR_ over 8 years ago
hmmm.. didn't I say this just last week? Think I'll stick with my UNLIMITED 16Mb LLU connection @ £10 p/m tyvm :)
Posted by CARPETBURN over 8 years ago
@herdwick yeah the choice aint hard but what happened to all the claims from the BT fan club on here BT adsl2+ was going to be so much cheaper and wouldnt have silly limits like current max stuff does
@KarlAustin you are wrong, you only have to look at news storys on this site to see the example of iplayer and similar services continue to get more and more popular, so jrawles example is relevant. I guess summing up BT products still suck and unlike some said the LLU suppliers wont be going anywhere, infact they are wetting their lips and laughing at these prices and limits
Posted by _TRIaXOR_ over 8 years ago
oh and before the pernickity ppl start complaining about the term Unlimited.. the FUP is 250Mb which is.. oh look, going to cost 73 quid :O with BT but STILL only £10 for me :P
Posted by _TRIaXOR_ over 8 years ago
"the FUP is 250Mb" er I meant 250GB, lol typo on my part as I was laughing so hard.. XD
Posted by CARPETBURN over 8 years ago
They are never going to admit they were wrong with all their hype talk of months back about BT adsl2+ being cheaper and having less limits _TRIaXOR_ Best to just leave them to it and laugh in their face as we happily go about downloading, browsing, emailing etc etc as much as we like with our adsl2+ while they harp on about how rubbish our services are supposed to be and are going to die any minute because of the wonderful things BT bring the public LOL, I wonder will this being an enta product also be subject to traffic shaping at certain times when the network is busy?
Posted by KarlAustin over 8 years ago
@comnut - Err... where did I say I wasn't prepared to pay for it. Regardless of business class broadband or not, the difference on my line between ADSL and ADSL2+ is about 5Mbit/s difference, as it happens, I actually do pay for a business class broadband, but that doesn't make ADSL go any faster than it physically can.
Posted by KarlAustin over 8 years ago
@CARPETBURN - 30% the survey said, sure it's on the rise, I've no doubt about that, never said it wasn't, but not everyone is going to do it. For example, my parents, myself - I see no need right now - Most of the stuff is junk you've seen 30 times before, just like Sky, which I already have.

I'm no BT fan, but I think things would be very different if the LLU brigade had to do 100% coverage (or as near as physically possible with the technology). It's easy to be cheaper if you've not go to provide to the expensive locations, or you're burning millions per day of investors money.
Posted by chrysalis over 8 years ago
I do hope people stop saying 21CN is the answer to LLU products now, it clearly is not. Not worthy of equal status.
Posted by CARPETBURN over 8 years ago
@KarlAustin... sorry i cant agree, if people still just browse and send emails and nothing else and dont watch streaming video or download more than they used to, then they would still be happy to have dial up. As it is though the site is full of people that moan that they cant get ADSL, cant get ADSL2+ moan about rural speed and so much more. One has to question if the majority dont download or stream in resonable numbers why do they want ADSL let alone ADSL2+
Posted by CARPETBURN over 8 years ago
Its clear now the new BT ADSL2+ products on price and what the customer gets for their money in no way comes even close to competing with LLU... I said and knew it wouldnt, others said it would, and everytime i said BT are nothing but hot air and promises i was shot down here several time... All i can say now to those people is who was tight huh? (actually to those people dont answer i dont need another BT are wonderful speech).
Posted by CARPETBURN over 8 years ago
^^^ grr sorry for the spelling errors, will change the keyboards batteries.
Posted by chrysalis over 8 years ago
I think it is also worth noting those that say burst speed has no direct cost, this is only due to manipulation of costs, BTw did used to cost burst speed accordingly before Capacity based pricing was introduced, all that is happening now is BT are simply absorbing the costs of providing burst speed from the extra revenue on BT centrals, isps are also absorbing it by increasing contention ratio and traffic shaping. If burst speed doesnt cost money why did BT charge for it in the first place? the first pricing for ipstream was more accurate but sales were too low so it got mutated.
Posted by chrysalis over 8 years ago
KarlAustin the "i dont download but when I do I want it now" is flatter than a pancake, if you downloading something trivial like a 2meg freeware app its not going to be signficantly slow on something like 2mbit, the only real need for such high speeds is for things like downloading iso images, which of course blow your 1 gig a month away.
Posted by KarlAustin over 8 years ago
I don't have a 1GB limit, I have a 30GB limit :)

Sorry, but you can't compare dialup and ADSL in terms of web browsing, 200+ms latency and at most 7KB/s downloads - Your average site would takes ages, bbc news site for example is 390KB, or a minute+ to download, that's why people want ADSL. Just because they could download more in a month, doesn't mean they want tom 60s vs. 2s is a bit of a no-brainer, even for my parents.

I quite regularly have to download 40-50MB doc packs, 600KB/s = 83s, 1200KB/s = 42s, all time saved if I'm waiting on that doc pack before I can carry on with my work.
Posted by chrysalis over 8 years ago
so you reffering to web browsing, I correct a major difference between dialup and broadband, but web browsing is no faster on 24mbit than it is on 8mbit, I also think there is very little difference even between 8mbit and 2mbit for web browsing. It be interesting to see how many isps can give you that 1200kB/sec on 21CN and if they can avoid throttling it.
Posted by Dawn_Falcon over 8 years ago
Karl - No, this is a reason to avoid websites overloaded with crap like the BBC one.
Posted by chrysalis over 8 years ago
yeah I prefer the old bbc site layout
Posted by CARPETBURN over 8 years ago
quote"...Your average site would takes ages, bbc news site for example is 390KB, or a minute+ to download, that's why people want ADSL. Just because they could download more in a month, doesn't mean they want tom 60s vs. 2s is a bit of a no-brainer, even for my parents"
Oh but hold on if all you want is basic surfing and email and dont download or watch streaming video why would you even be going to the bbc news site anyway, especially as half the links you can click on have streaming video...hmmmm
Posted by CARPETBURN over 8 years ago
Ive said it over and over again the web is becoming more and more media rich in its content. This isnt 1988 its 2008, the days of just a bit of text on a screen are long gone and so should silly caps be gone. The 3 gig a month service adsl24 are offering when it comes to a line running at upto 24Mb is a complete joke... Thats not enough to download a linux ISO, not enough for a HD film, not even enough for the whole weeks worth of Eastenders for the mrs... Its almost like having your own F1 car, taking it to a track and driving only 1 lap, a complete waste of time and money
Posted by _TRIaXOR_ over 8 years ago
"Its almost like having your own F1 car, taking it to a track and driving only 1 lap"

More like pulling it out of the pit area and stopping.. :\
Posted by CARPETBURN over 8 years ago
quote"More like pulling it out of the pit area and stopping.. :\"

Mwahaha atleast i was kind enough to say it gets up to full speed, just not for long... I guess your F1 car is owned by those a distance from the exchange LOL
Posted by _TRIaXOR_ over 8 years ago
muahaha Serious Traffic Management.. brrm Dsh! X-D
Posted by CARPETBURN over 8 years ago
The grid lights represent the BT home hub flashing away like a christmas tree as its numerous security flaws combined with the new speed increase is just one step too many for the buggy box to handle... Hooray for BT services, prices and equipment all breakthroughs in modern day internet *BIG cough* LOL
Posted by Luciano over 8 years ago
At the risk of being shot down in flames. I have to agree with the users here about keeping below a certain download limit. The internet has indeed changed but why are we reinventing the wheel as regards TV programs. We have perfectly adequate methods for viewing Tv content. It’s called an aerial/cable/satellite. These on the whole don’t involve bandwidth problems. One can still record programs when not around (hard disk recorders) and if you record with Windows Media Centre, you can manipulate it into any format required for playback on most devices.
Continued on next thread.
Posted by Luciano over 8 years ago
My feeling is that the more bandwidth provided the more that is used, just like road building, more roads, more cars using them. It’s human nature. I appreciate the argument about whether a low usage user needs a fast speed. Well the answer is yes. If you are in the computing industry there is a need to download large service packs and programs quickly as well as VOIP etc. This is in keeping with what that internet was originally designed for. Maybe the answer is a split system that totally separates content, one for media entertainment and one for the rest.
Posted by CARPETBURN over 8 years ago
I guess its called development of technology Luciano, a bit like TV got invented, then it started broadcasting more than a few hours a day, then more channels got added, then satelite TV came along, then digital TV came out.... TV over the net is just another evolution, one what will happen and is happening whether ISPs or people like it or not.
Same thing has happened with Music and radio, music used to come on big black shiney plastic things and radio out of a amazing wooden box.. Now it comes in bits and bytes of data... Same type of development, different format.
Posted by Luciano over 8 years ago
The previous advances have always brought something new to the market. At the moment iplayer in particular is just regurgitating content that can be had elsewhere. This to me is not an advance but a step backwards as it uses up bandwidth just to satisfy people who don't want to access the content in a different way. If we had infinite bandwidth, maybe. I’m not so sure this will ever happen as the minute more bandwidth comes on stream something else comes along that will use it up.
This to me is technology for the sake of technology not an advance. Too many choices is not always a good thing.
Posted by CARPETBURN over 8 years ago
We can agree to disagree but like it or not more media intensive things over the internet is the future, always has been.
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